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Note: This text has been automatically extracted via Optical Character Recognition (OCR) software. The text has not been manually corrected and should not be relied on to be an accurate representation of the item.
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8 * . . ____ ^^^! " — " ****""" Hr B . Bmice , jaa ., felt bound to tar , " fter / l f t B tile evidence of tha committee wnic& ansea teatte " ™ aemfeerg , that it presented a parallel case to tbslot i aroath . ( Hear , bar . ) ln both , tWresmea werethebody ptOTea totam incorrupt ; and . tbera « i no mow CTideHCBin the Yarmouth cm to justify Us dl 6 fran-* £ TSK 3 W ^ - —« - oLn the pSle of pBrf . btegm . r 4 y tb . » emW Sa by U-ese corrupt bodies . He celled upon the go . ^ mU to remedya malady , which , much as any other of the bodypolitic , required to be " ««*«* . ft fc ^ 3 ^^^^ ^^^ ^^^ - ^^^^^—^^^^
; „ j fr SoME urged ibatanegnalmBasiireofjasticegiioula be dealt oat to all corrupt constilusnekB on somewilform principle , and that while eae corrupt borough was disfranchised , another should not be permitted to elect a new number , as Bewgley was allowed to do . He contended that DerBj ought to be placed , in the same category with Horskam . It vtas peculiarly the dutj of goterntneat to eee to this mstttr , at a time when so mach atten . ion was Mug paid to the qutsticu of t&e representation of Jne country . { Hear , hear . ) He moved that the writB for Derby be snipendsd until a fall inquiry had been made into the « bole subject . ( Hear , hear . ) The Earl of Liscots supported tbe amendment , and expressed his hops that tha noble lord at the head of the government would lose so time in inquiring into the matter . . _ .
Mr Ceildebs , as chairman of tha Derby election committee , begged to say that the committes kad not recom . mended tha disfranchisement of the borough , because , although bribery had been , ne doubt , proved against Bins voters , and thtre whb a strong cbbb of suspicion in reference to about 200 out of the 400 freemen , yet , as the constituency numbared 2 , , 1 , 500 of these btivg £ 16 householders , against whom there appeared no taint , it had beea considered urjast t » the 1 , 700 or 1 , 800 voters to disfranchise them for the fault of the minority . He should , on the same principle , oppose the suspension of the writs .
Lord J . Rusexlc observed that the committee ap . geared to have decided that there were certain caseB in ^ rhiek bribery had been proTed against the fresmen of Derby , and that there were other cases far more numerous in which bribery more extensive had not been proved , thcugb . it was strongly suspected . H ' - ' considered that so much had been stated in the report of the commi'tee ss to render it fitting that there should be a further inquiry into tho corruption of the freemen of that borough . H 2 therefore agreed with Mr Hume that the issue of this writ ought to be stayed . Et could not take np the inquiry on the part of the government , in consequent of the multiplicity of business fey which he was overwhelmed at present ; but ho hoped that lord Zancoln , or some other member not hardened with the cares of cfihr . would take charge ef it .
Sir R . Peel expressed great satisfaction at the speech ¦ w hich Lor < 5 John Russell had just made ; for on reading tbe evidence tsken in this case , ha had come to the conclusion that it was quite impossible to refuse far . ther inquiry into ths bribery which had prevailed among thefreemea of Derby at the last election . Mr O'Cosifoa expressed his intention to vote for the issue of the writ , thinking that the whole constituency eheuld not be punished for the fault of nine freemen . After & lengthened discussion the house divided on Mr Hume ' * amendment , when the numbers were—Aye 1 S 9 Noes 48 Majority in its favour ——156 So the writ was not allowed to issue . Projected Pj . c ? £ a P&ocsssiOK . —S f J . Y . BntiEt Pegged to a « k the right hon . baronet opposite whether ie could give ths houss any information on the subject of a projected procession of 100 , 000 paupers to be headed by Ur C . Coshrane oa Easter Monday ?
Sir G . Gbei said thatrtree weeksago he had received e letter from Mr C . Cochrane , stating tSat he had a petition and address to present to her Majesty , and that it was his intention to come down to the Home-offio ? , accompanied by a body of petitioners , on the 24 th of April , la order to place it in his hands . He had , thereupon , informed Mr C . Cochrane that any address of the nature referred to might bs presented to him in the usual course by himself , attended by a few persons , but that ao such document accompanied by a largo number' of persons would be received . He bad also informed Mr C Cochrane that it weuld not bo convenient for him to
receive any depstationer address during the Easter week . He ( Sir G . Grey ) had received letters froa various poor-Iiw unions , stating that letters addressed by MrC . Cjch . Tsne to person ef the namo of Jones , and others of tke rams of Sal b , had been received at tbe wsrkboHses , in the hope that they would find some ene of thise names in the workhouses . Those letters stated that the petition of the pjor was to ba presented by tbe writer on Ssster Monday , accompanied by 150 , 000 paupers , an 3 fts boped those who received them would make every endeavour to accompany theproctsiion . Since that , he had received no information that it was Mr Cochrane ' s
intention to resort to any such proceeding a 3 the depu"tstion he had referred to , and he ( Sir G . Grey ) thought that that inriividntl might fee safely left in the hands of "the polics commissioners . ( A laugh . ) Eajtes Eecess —Lird J . Kdsseh , in accordance ' -with a promise eiten by him to the noble lord the member for PalUirk on a former evening , would state the courts he would propose to the house to follow with respect to the adjournment during tbe Easter recess , subject of course to the progress of the Crown and Government Security Bill . He proposed to move that the fcouse phould adjourn on Wednesday ncrt until the Saturday following , and from that day until Monday tbe 1 st of May . Crows asd Goyebhksnt Secobiii Bill . —The report -of this bill was brought ap . Hr AGLiossr moved a clause , rendering misdemeanor punishable by imprisonment , with the view ! o leaving out the words by open and advised speaking , ' which was negatived by a n ? vjority of 67 , the numbers 117 to 53 .
A clause praised by Sir W . Clat , also in reference to the omission of the objectionable words , and the substitation cf a proviso , enacting that when a second offence " was charged , the offending party should not ha admitted *> bail , was negatived by 83 to 39 , majority 44 . The A . TTO 3 NET GiNEBiL sabmitted a proviso that informations must be sworn within six days after the commission of tbe effjncp , and the magistrate ' * wanxatissue within ten days from that period , which , after a debate , Xte . 1 carried by 142 to 30—majority 112 . Hr Bsight moved as an amendment that the powers of the act should sot bi invoked , except at the instance of the Law Officers of tho Crown , which was rejected by a Eisjority ef 121 , the numbers were 49 to 170 . Cajtain HiiEis moved , but subsequently withdrew , a clauit proposing to empower the government to disarm tfee people of Ireland of pikes and similar hostile weapons . The report was fmnreoBived , and tbe bill was ordered to be read a third time on Tuesday , the debate to be takes on that question st 12 oM-jck .
In ths course of the debate , Lord John Edssell oongratuiatad Mr Humo un his fint exhibition aa an iroulcal and sarcastic speaker , and thanked the gsntleitea en the Conservative beaches for the disinterested support which they bad reeeatly sfiarded ministers , and of which minister * felt justly prrud . Hr Disbaeli , fo'Iowing up the attack said , he was not surprised at the ironical tone of tho hen . member for Hontroea at the present moment , when he remembered the peculiar aad novel position in which the hon . member iiadb en placed within the last few fiajs . The nan . member was at the heid of a numerous but not verj welldisciplined army , and he could not cemplain of not having sought a fair field on which to exercise thesa . ( ' Hear , ' and n laugh . ) Tke hon . member was now really In hie political youth , and full of the vigour ef his new birth . He was about to eEttr iato a more active career , an 3 , with a considerable interval of practice with his ntw ¦ forces , he mijht meet with success . ( 'Hear , ' ana laugbter . )
' Coppeb ahd Lead Dotieb . —The Chascellos of the Eic 3 E <} UE £ ( hea movod that tho house resolve itself into committee of ths whole bouse on the Copper asd Lead Duties . Sir C , LsHo . f m tved , as an amendment , that a select comtnittes be appointed to inquire into the eff : ct of the existing duties oa the importation and production of copper ore . Thehoused ^ vH e ^— ortheoriginalmotion , 102 ; against i ^ 35 : ' majority , GJ . Th-3 h iui 9 tkca went iato committee , aod the Csjncellus of the CscntQrsE propounded resolutions for the reduction of the duiie > , Hr GliDSTONE said he should not interpose his amendment for tne total repeal of the duties until tho houBe went into committee en the bill ; in tbe meantime he ¦ wished to be informed whether the government would be prepared to tako a similar course to that now proposed with reference io tin .
The Chascellob of the Excsiqueb , not having re-« ived any representations on the subject of tin , did not eea any immediate necessity for s&ch a reduction . LordG . Bestisck moved that the Chairman report progreEB , when ths committee divided—ayes , ; noe 9 , 77 ; when , the raso ' utions were agreed to , and the house Tesnmeo . On the motion of Sir W . SoHE&viLtE , the select committee on the Landlord cai Truant ( Irtland ) Bill was nominated | and the house adjourned at one o ' clock , TUESDAY , APJUL 18 . HOUSE OF LORDS . —State or Dpbltk . —Lord BSAUHOKT asked what sups hc 4 been taken by the gorarr-muit with respect to the training of crmea" men in Dublin ?
TheMsrquis oflAKHJOw . 'rerepIicdthathe had said on Monday , is sn ^ a to a simUar question , that if fesis was uny training goicg on it ffR « not ef so decisive and distinct a character as to authorise the Lord Lteutenanttoputthe act sUoded to test night in force ; nevertheless he felt satMed that if anything of the sort coald be dearly prove * , the L si tfcnieBant would imsa « 5 iate ! y put that net in force ; an i he was noir able to State that proceedings in the nature of training to the use of arras haJ V . e .-a discovere d a day or two e : ncp , to 5 > a in - o- ress Ju Bub in , end befora the aveniiiS all the pers-ns sngsged in it baa teon arrested—( hear , hear)—end aay oshcr socUty ass . atled for tha ssma purpose woiHb 9 imme £ iately " proc-seded Bgainst in the seme « & ? . ( Hear , tear > It mSghl oe wtll to U&& tliat tinder HsproTiB-onsof the Ba ^ lin Polics Ac ' , flrin ? at a mark wss ii ! S » ai ( ana liable to punisbmeat . ^ Eear ;> . . A'SOTSE . ' lH-rnEloaDB . —Ontha motion of Lord JtosTBiGLE tba Htcg niiaace * Electioa B ; U pa ^ ed
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' ' " On tne motion that tho report be brought up , Lord B&OCdHAK proposed tbo following amendment ; 1 That nothing in this act contained shall be of force , by way of retrospective or « s ) i » rf /( M ( o law , to affeot any vested interest , or decide any question bow pending befare any court , or in either house oS parliament . ' Their lordships abided—For the amendment ... 21 Against it 16 Majority —6 Lord Mohteagle complstaed that tho noblo and learned lord had divided tbe house , after having stated that it hbb not feii intention to do so , in consequents of which several peers had left the house . U surprises of tnisBOrt were to be practised on btr Majesty ' s government , all of whom Toted for the noble and learned lord 1 amendment , he should like to know how the public eer . vice was to ba carried on ! In neither house of parhementhaate e « r known en instance of any BUCQ pro . ceedlng . H * would give notice that on to-morrow he wonld move the house to reverse the decision to which ^^^* _„ __ t . _„„_» , . -.-.
it had just came . Lord Beocghah said , he sever saw an instance of a more complete tot of recollection 0 ! what puiefl Vithln the last hour than his noble friend exhibited in bis proper person nt this moment . ( Laughter . ) The noW and learned lord then explained that , in the first Inataace , he promised he wonld take tbe division OH tho third readme-, but in consequence 0 / a suggestion made by hlsnobleVriend opposite , ho stated that ha would move his amendment . Whether the ameadraettt was taken in committee or upon tbe report w « s a matter of absolute Indifference . His noble ftlend had said that ha ( Lord Brougham ) had only whispered hlg intention of proposing the amendment , but it was a whisper made across tbe table whilst he sat in his pla « e . The Lobd Chanceliob . — And nobody mado the slightest objection .
Lord Bbooobah— Certainly not . Nothing could be more unfounded than the assertion that in assisting on a division he ban takentbelr lordshipB by wrptiae . The Earl of JfAlHEsatrar said he bad been in the habit of collecting votes and obtaiaiog the attendance of the nuble lords who generally acted » ilh that , the Op . position , side of the House , and ho was asked on this occasion to Eolicit the presence of such noble lord * as agreed te this bill . He did so in the usual way , and then iHsutred of his noble and learned friend ( Lord
BroUihara ) whether he Wds going to divide the Housa on his amtnament His reply was , ' I have no intention of the sort ; I only want to record my opinion In opposition to this Bill . ' ( Hear , bear , hear . ) Ha ( Lord ilalmesbury ) then told his noble frieuds on that Bide of tba hooae that fhere would be no division , and that they might resume any occupation that would be more agreeable to them than the present , without any danger of having the amendment oarried . His impression wa » , that the noble and lesraed lord had aot acted as fairly as he was generally accustomed to do , ( Hear , hear . )
Lord BbjUOHA * ( with great warmth)—My lords , I have enly to give my most complete , stringent , and perempory denittl to that . ( ' Order , ' aad laughter . ) I willnotbecjlUd to order for stating a feet , I never heard the notls earl say a word of the kind . I heard him ask the question whet > . tr I meant to debate tonight , and I was told that the debate was to be taken on the third realinff . Ko noble lord cculd say that I said I would not divide . If I did not divide , any noble lordlay noble and learned friend opposite ( Lord Campbell ) might do so . Neither the neble lord nor any humaD being could « ay that I promised not to divide . Tie question was about debating , and I repeatedly said that I did not intend to do so . Tdb MsrqaiH of Lansdowiie was understood to « ay , that no effort was mad * on thepait of the government to Eecurs the attendance of noble Iordi favourable to tbe
Bill . Tne Earl of JTALirESBtntT laid he had been frequently asked for information with respeot to such matters , and therefore it was nataral that some noble lords on the other side of tbe house should inquire of him . He had certainly ) ei some of them to believe that there would b » no division in consequence cf what the aobls find learaed lord had told him . Lord Bbougdah— I ask the noble lord whether I eaid , ' I do not mean to divide ?' The Earl of Malhksburt—I asked , 'Will you divide !' Lord BaouQBAH—Did I say , f I won't divide V The noble earl won ' t Ecrew himself up to say so . The Earl of Maihesbubt—The noble and learned lord said , 'I have no inteution to io so . ' ( Hear , hear . ) ' Lord BBOtraHAH—Meaning thereby that I bad no intention 01 going into a debate on tho clause . ( Laughter . )
Earl Gbet here came to the rescue and the subject dronped-Tho Crown and Government Security Bill was then broegkt up from the Cemmoua , and read a first time . Their lordships then adjourned to sit on Wednesday for the second reading of the Gagging Bill . HOUSE OF COMMONS . —The Speaker teok the chair at twelve o ' clock in order to hurry oa the Gagging Bill . Chabtist Meeting oh BLACKHEATH . ~ Mr P . O'Cok-N 6 B , as an act of justice to the Tikes newspaper , b < gged
permission of the house te r . ad a note from Lieutenant-Geaeral Napier , wbo had asserted positively on a former oeeasion , with reference to a report of certain ipaechts alleged to bave been delivered upon Blackheath , that no such meeting hid been held . General Napier now stated that he bad made inquiry , and f cund that a small assemblage kad taken place on Blackfeeath for the purpose of adopting a petition , and that the sptechi-a reperted in the Tiuss bad no doubt b < ea made at that as e . mbly . The gallant general accordingly begged leave to correct the error into which he had fallen .
AworssHENT or TH 3 House . —L- > rd J . Russbh gave notice that at the meeting of tha house to-morrow he should move that the house adjourn at its rising until Saturday next . Trie noble Ldbd said he should likewise move that after Easter , orders of the day should take precedence of notices of motion on Thursdaje . Cbown and Govebkhent SicoEHf Bill . —On the erder of the day for the third reading of this bill , Mr Hche expressed great doubts whether tba
opponents of this bill bad carried thtir opposition ts the full extent that the novel and extraordinary character of the meaBura rtquired . He warned the noble lord that any attempt to carry into effect the objectionable clauses of the bill , would be followed by consequences much more serious ' than he anticipated . The government had pasted two coercion bills during the present session and aa income-tax bill , but not a single remedial measure . He feared that , seeing these things , the people would be driven to other measures to obtain reforms . He moved that the blii be read a third time that day six
months . Sir D . L . Evisa objected to certain portions of the hill , but he could not concur in an indiscriminate censure of the whole bill . Mr O'Connor said : That he would now attack theeiul and military position of the hon . and gal lant officer , ( Sir De Lacy Evans ) , who bad just sat down . That hon . gentleman had made a great blunder , and a valuable admission of his authority would be relied upon by a jury ; or if a prisoner under this act could make such a sweeping defence as the hon . and gallant officer had made , in refutation of the charge brought against him by the hon , member for Finsbury , then he ( Mr O'Connor ) would apprehend no danger from the present bill . That
gallant officer admitted having used the words attributed to him , but believes he didn't use them because they vrere not reported in the Times newspaper . ( Hear , hear , and laughter . ) This would be a defence that every Chartist may truly set up , but perhaps , the deficiency would be supplied by a police spy or an informer . ( Hear , hear . ) But he contended that the confession of the gallant officer himself , would subject him to an indictment under this bill , had it been in existence in the palmy days of Reform , and then he would have the honour of transportation in company with the noble lord and his colleagues . ( Hear , hear . ) Why , what had the gallant officer told us ? That his invasion of London with 100 , 000 , men wss not to intimidate the then
government , but to strengthen its handsjtljusproYjng that men alone constituted his notion of crime , tj eeause he admitted that he was ready to march upon London—a very military phrase , —ii tbe bill was rejacted . ^ Hear , hear . ) And then if words advisedly spoken are to be proof of the intent , the gallant officer and his confederates would be guilty of the burning of Bristol , Newcastle , and Nottingham Castle ; and as parliceps criminis wduld have merited punishment equally with those whose crime was the overt act , while the gallant officer ' s words were the intent . ( Hear , hear . ) Now , no such results from open and advised speaking had taken place on Monday last , while the transactions of that day , that did not , occur , we made tbe pretext for this uncoil ' stitutional measure—this violation of the Bill of
Rights—this infraction of the liberties of freemen . ( Hear , hear . ) It was his boast to be able to tell the working classes that the very existence of a ministry was primd facie proof of its popularity ; because the power of speech and combination , if properly used , armed the masses with the means of hurling any obnoxious ministry from power . ( Hear , hear . ) Thus , he had been enabled boastfully to' tell them that theirs was a constitution worth living for and worth dying for ; but when tb at constitution was violated in its most cherished principle , by the very men whose boast it was that it was based upon the blood of their ancestorSj bis mouth was gagged , and he dared not practice such a deception . ( Hear , hear . ) He had asked the question several times , but bad received no answer ; he had asked the meaning of
'OPEN AND ADYISED SPEAKING , ' but not a member in that house had ventured an answer . ( Hear , hear . ) He had stated another fact lu answer to the presumed clemency of ministers ; namel y , that the bill was a boon , as it was a relaxation of the rigid law of treason ; but he reminded the house that the law of treason in that form , in which it was susceptible of proof , was left untouched , and remained precisely aa was before , while the boasted boon was
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this ; that the proposed relaxation applied to crimes which did not happen once in a century , while the increased vigour was applicable to crimes which may happen every day in the year . ( Hear , hear , and loud cheers . ) Well , then , where was the boon ? Where was the clemency ? Where was the relaxation ? ( Hear , hear . ) When they were passing tbe Irish Coercion Bill , he told them that its effects would be to terrify the injured from appealing for redress to the law , lest coercion may be the answer to the rebel offender , and thus the really injured were deprived of the law ' s protec-. *«¦ , 1 . ii . j __»__•• • . ¦ _
tion . ( Hear , hear . ) He applied the same rule to this law , thus—that dread of treuching upon this inexplicable enactment , would close the mouths of those who had real grievances to complain of , but which they would smother in pent-up anger , least their open and advised t proclamation should subject them . . to the ignominious fate of felons . ( Hear , hear , and cheers . ) Would there be safety , then , or weakness * in this treasonable conspiracy against the prerogative of the Crown and the constitutional rights of the people ? ( Hear , hear . ) Could the noble lord draw no inference between the desertion of old allies and friends and
the rabid howl of bis incessant and bitter enemies ? ( Hear , hear . ) Did he imagine , or expect that , while he was centralising all power within that house , even to the administration of a pauper law , to check , impede , or stop the tributary streams of knowledge which were hourly runniHg into the reservoir of mind , and which , ere long , would break down his flimsy barriers , burst the floodgates of ignorance , asd overwhelm his centralised corruption ? ( Hear , hear , and cheers . ) He shewed them before , that the ordinary law was sufficient to repress what is called sedition in 1839 , 1840 , 1841 , a . nd 1842 , and while panic was the justification . urged in favour of this measure , his answer was ,
that not a political offence had been committed lor the last six years ; and , perhaps , this awful stillness had alarmed authority more than sudden outbreaks . But Ireland was to be their battle ground . In 1833 they asked for coercion—that remedial measures may be administered in time of peace-they had since had the stillness of the grave , with passive obedience and non-resistance even to culpable slavery , and behold , Ireland ' s long-withheld remedial measurefo make complaint of bitter wrong and deepoppres * sion , a transportable felony 1 ( Hear , hear , and cheers . ) And , then , the state of France was urged ( but he ( Mr O'Connor ) looked for no foreign aid ,
nor could he be over censorious on bitter denunciation of suffering and famine , backed by coercion , leaning to burning words , ( Hear , hear . ) There were two points in his speech of last night , for which the honourable member for Cockermoutb , whom he was sorry to miss from his place , had taken him to task for rather uncourtebusly ; those points were , the difficulty imposed upon tbe accused of rebutting words after a lapse of sixteen days , professed to be accurately reported by a spy or informer—while they were fresh upon bis memory ; the other was the antagonism which the Attorney General's definition would cause between the law officers of
the Crown and the committing justice . ( Hear , hear . ) Now the hon . member for Cockermouth censured him ( Mr O'Connor ) for his furious and inflammatory speech , while , curious to say , he used every one of his arguments , but in milder tones . ( Hear , hear . ) He would give them an instance 0 , the manner in which government prosecutions were got up . At the Lancaster trials , in 1843 , while the right hon . baronet , Sir James Graham , wa « upon the bench , he ( Mr O'Connor ) in the cross-examination of one of the principal witnesses , extracted the fact , that the said witness , together with his whole family , had been liberated fiotn the workhouse for the express purpose of incitirg the people to
disorder . There was a policeman also examined , who admitted that he had transcribed the words sworn to raany months after they were spoken , from the memory of one who could not write . Well , then , was not that power enough , without tbe infliction of this treasonable act ? ( Hear , hear . ) The house had the admission that the progress of Chartism justified the minister in his appeal ; his answer to that was , that those who toil for a miserable subsistence , or withered in the workhouse , were possessed with the conviction that labour is the source of all wealth , and that a cultivation of the national resources is the primary duty of all governments , and they will not longer submit to see the land of
their country a barren wilderness and a desert , while they are ready to make it profitable by the application of their labour . ( Hear , hear . ) They will not starve , and see their families starve , while idlers fare sumptuously on their toil j neither will your treason bill convince the labourer that labour can be justly represented by noble lords , baronets , landlords , and ' squires , with obsolete privileges to uphold ; by admirals , captains , and lieutenants in the Navy , with selfish interests to serve ; by generals , colonels , majors , captains , and lieutenants in the Army ; by bankers , merchants , traders , and speculators ; by over 100 railway contractors , chairmen , and directors ; by barristers and attorneys ; by placemen ,
pensioners , and idle paupers . ( Hear , hear , and cheers . ) No ! such a representation was not in accordance with the active genius of the present age . Let the noble lord bear this fact in mind , that while all other countries which have but recently thrown off the yoke of despotism , are granting every point in the Charter , he is trying to arre 3 t its progress by making its open and advised advocacy a transportable felony . ( Hear , hear . ) How now could they boast of their people ' s loyalty to the throne , if expressions of contempt for the ministers were to be construed zs treason against tbe Crown . The ministers were the real traitors . ( Hear , hear . ) The landlords sitting on the opposition benches , vainly hoped to strengthen
their position by acquiescence in this barbarous act , but he cautioned them by what was nearest to their hearts , that , ten days more rain and their sun would set . The wheat upon the cold grounds and clay lands was already perishing , and he should like to know whether bankrupt merchants , traders , shopkeepers , and aw unemployed people , would be able to spare thirty-three millions next year , to supply the place of what might be more profitably produced at home . ( Hear , hear . ) He had gone with his party , and he would still go with hia party , through evil report and good report , until he saw a fair day ' s wage for a fair day ' s work , and political power to secure and defend it . As the proceedings of Monday had been repeated to surfeit , he again would ask ,
what obloquy , what taunt and condemnation , he would not have deserved , if he had skulked like a coward and abandoned his party in the hour of danger . And he repeated there , as he had done elsewkere , that , after thesilly and boastful threats by some poor gentlemen—who were too proud to work , and too uoor to live without labour , and whose order had aforetiraejeopardisedChartisra—lhat the government was justified in taking precautionary measures for protection of the peace . ( Hear . ) Ay ' l said Mr O ' Connor , I understand that cheer , but had it not been for the unconstitutional defiance of the government , there would have been no threat to create alarm , and the procession would have passed off as the meeting did . ( Hear , hear . ) But he would refer to precedent , of which the house was so fond . The
hon . member for Liskeard ( Mr C . Duller ) stated that Ireland was in a state of incipient revolution , which nothing , hut the authority of Mr O'Uonnell could repress , and that discontent would break ; out into open rebellion upon his demise . Well , then with this warning , was not the government culpable in allowing the cause of discontent to remain , instead of proposing remedies to avert the danger . ( Hear , hear . ) But as the danger of the passing tirae'had been cited , he would call the attention of the house to words which had been used by tut deceased gentleman , in the presence of him ( Mr O'Connor ) . He said , ' Let me have a petition from five hundred thousand FIGHTING MEN , and let the hon . home
understand that they are . determined to fight , but that they humbly pray for redress . ' ( Hear , hear . ) But have not the "Whigs ever been the patrons , the abettors and promoters of treason ? And are not iheir benches now filled , ay , and their offices too , with traitors of the first water ? ( Hear , hear . ) He then drew the attention of the house to this fact , and it was strictly in point to the present state of Ireland—in 1839 , Mr Robert Kelly Douglas , the proprietor or manager of the Birmingham Journal , travelled through Scotland witli a Bainple of rifleu , snd recommended the people to establish rifle oluba . ( Hear , hear . ) Mr- George Edmonds , a solicitor of the same to . vn , used language equally violent ,- but
instead lif transporting them , you gaye-Rirmingbum a corporation , and pensioned your co-r ' elon _ s upon tbe industrious poor . ( Hear , hear . ) What said Mr A termed , in 1839 , in his ( Mr O'Connor '*) presence , and bafore 20000 U men ; he sai'i , "Lft them refuse the Cbarter , and with the stamp of my foot , a million Eugliah hearts will respond ; and uhould I stamp asain , 2 . 000 , 000 English arms would be raifiod Co its enr ' urceuienii . ( Hear , hear . ) Well , v ? hrtt more violent language than he had , quoted ' nal been used either iu England or in ltelund ? 'Q Bce gag the people , once , put fettero ufsoa tbf , fa > a expression of public opinion , and there woutf , D 0 an ' ond to tae boast ; of the British conatitutiop . That
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would ba tho effect of this bill , for it would prevent men from speaking , leat they should violate its provisions . For himself , he should leave 01 ? speaking extemporaneously , he would write his speeches , and read them , and then hand them over with his compliments to the Attorney-GeneraVto make what use he plaeBed of ; and he would adviae all Chartist orators to do tbe same , and he hoped spine hon . membev would move that they be printed in a blue book , which would be much more instructive to the home than many other hooks , ( Hear , hear , and laughter . ) He appealed to the noble lord—who , after all , he would rather see at the head of the government than any other man , if lie had the courage to carry out the principles that he had taught the people 10 contend _ ... U l * n * krt nffjrtf- g \ f thin hill fni * it TVAiiir ) nv&vavtfr
for—not to aully his own fair fame , not to derogate from the reputation of his ancestors as lovers of freedom , by the authorship of a measure like this . The Reform Bill had been oarried , but the people were now looking for itB fruits , and he trusted the aoble lord would not disappoint them . The hon . snd learned member next declaimed against the prinoiple ef centralisation , contending that what the people wanted , and were dfctemvned to have , wag local power . If he had given to this bill what was called a factious opposition , it was baoauae he regarded with terror the precedent that would be established for hon . gentlemen how on the Opposition side of the house , if they should pass ^ over to the Treasury benches . It was a gagging bill , and it would operate
as a gagging bill hereafter upon the noble lord himself , when he should bo in opposition . Before he sat down , he would tell the hon . and gallant member for Wi stminster ( Sir Ds Lacy Evans ) , an Irish anecdote , very much in point and striotly in keeping with his repudiation of his former principles , or , rather , speeches There was a farmer ' s boy who got permission from his master to attend an Irish fair , for a frolic ; the master gave him half-aci ' uwn , and lent him a hor ? e and cart to enable him to treat his mother to a day ' s amusement . When he changed his half-crown in a tent , and after he bad spent ene shilling and sixpence , h « discovered that tbe other shilling was a fbtgwy . He went in great dismay to the man who gave him the bad
shilling , but the man denied the charte . Thus baulked of a portion of his fun , he left tbe fair lather early , but Dot before a row had commepf od , and in passing through which a ' stray stone , ' as it was called , hit his mother l and killed her . The police came up , and upon questioning him he told them that he knew tho roan who lulled his mother , anil he conducted the p'lice to tho tent of the man who gave him the bad shi'lin ? . The man , hearing the row , was running back hurriedly to his tent , which gave an air of credit to the witness's story . He was apprehended and brought to trial , but fortunately fop him Baron Pennefather was hi « ju 3 ge , and although the witness had completely puzzled counsel , Baron Pennefacher was not satisfied with his mode of eiviDB evidence .
He asked the witneiB-- ' Now , witness , upon yoi r oath , ia that the man that killed your mother ?' The witness looked at the prisoner aid replied , 'Then , upon my oa'b , my lordship , that's the man that kilt my mother , sure enough . ' The Baron wai not satisfied , and he said , ' Now , witneps , attend Jo mo . Now , witness , upon your oath , did you see the prisoner at the bar throw the stone that killed your metherf' The witnessanswored , 'Then upon my oath , my lordship , I can ' t swear that that ' s the man that threw the stone that kilt my mother , but by the vartu of iny 01 th that's the man that gave me the bad shil ; in (? , ' anyhow . ' ( Roars of laughter ) Now the moral of tha tale U ,. that a jury will find , not that the prisoner has oommitttd fe'ony , but that ho was tho man who wants the Charter , anyhow . ( Great
laughter . ) He would continue his opposition to tbia bill , and , aa it appeared that Her Majesty's Oppoaition had now been regularly and conHtitutianally formed , of which the hon . member for Montroee was to be henceforth their leader , —( a lau ? h , ) --he said it not tauntingly ; but , whosoever might be the leader , it was to be hoped that the f arty would ahow more of resolution and courage than they had last night , when it had been his ( Mr O'Connor's ) purpose to impede the progress of the bill , and frustrate it , if pnasibl ? , by any means the forms of the house would allow . It appeared to him that on that occasion the party , although ranged under their new banner , had abwn themBelres rather faint . If they really intended to siiccaed , they / must eommeace their opposition bravely , and continue ii perseveringly .
Mr H ? ad ! ara , Mr Horaman , Mr Adderley , Mr Ker Seymor , and Mr Mitchell spoko in faveur ef the third reading . Sir R . Peel supported tho government in carrjlrg thin measure , which , in the peculiar state of the times , he considered to fee necessary . The magnificent demonstration made by the loyal and peaceable on the occastoaof the late dhturbanoa abundantly proved that the public opinion of this country was decidedly averse to all great constitutional change ; but it was the duty of the government and of tho legislature to do their duty , and buow to the lojal and well-dlspoaed that they were determined to Maintain tho fundamtntal institutions of the country . [ Sir Robe ? t in the course of his speech mado an attack upon the Chartists and MrO'Oonuor . ]
He said : The question is , whether , under the circumstances of tfae case , vrith the avowals which have been made , and with the influence of nample io other conntrleR , it is unreasonable and unjust that for a limited period , he who , by malicious and advised speakiDR-, shall try to induce tbe people of this kiogdoro to effect certain oVjpcts by levying war , shall be subject to the penalties of felony . ( Hear , hear . ) I confess I think it in not . ( Hear , hear . ) I see tho language nsed ; I ob . serve tbe congregation of immense masses liable to sedi . tlon , excited for n © other purpose which I can imagine than that of intimidation . I draw a distinction between the mere assemblage of those parties—for that does [ not come within tbls bill—and that offence to which this bill really refers ; but I look upon the assemblage itaelf
as a symptom of the excitement of tbe times ; and although I may not ba able to punish it by law—for it may not bs advisable nl wayB to resort to law for the purpose of preventing * uch evil?—yet I do think that the congregation of enormous masses under tho pretext of presenting pntitionp , is a practice for which those who are ihe leaders of euoh an organisation are subject , if not to lego ! , yet to the hlghost moral responsibility . I cannot codccIvo for what purpoBe—certainly not for the purpose of encouraging tho doliberote consideration of that for which tbey wish—I cannot oonoeivo for what purpose those enormous numbers , magnified by report far beyond their real amount—( htor , hear , and laughter)—hnva beon brought together , except tha * of Intimidation . ( Hear , hear . ) Sir , the bonoarnble and
learned raomber for Nottingham ( Mr F . O Connor ) , whom I havo always heard express himself here with perfect ( food humour , has disclaimed a'l intention of intimidation , and ha * repudiated , I hope sincerely , the leust design of creating confusion end disorder ; Bat while I ( jive tho honourable and learned gentleman full crooitior sincerity , let mo t ? ll him that those who bring together 100 , 000 persons run 0 rerf great risk of creating disorders . ( Hear , hear . ) Even tho honourable and leurnod gontleman ' s professions of loyalty do not alto , gethor saUafy me . Ho says , I am no party to tbia alleged int > ntion . I deprecate the conduct of those wbo advine arming . I am only for ponccHblo anil loyal means . As for establishing a republic , tbat I utterly dlfidaim I bnva boon for years an nttsohBd and faithful Bervnnt of
the Crown ; and » b for democratic inUttutionB *—I beg thejhonourable and learned gentleman ' s pardon— ' as for republican institutions , —( laughter)—I disavow any deBiro for them . ' ( Haar . hear . ) Whilo thehou . and lenrned gentleman , however , disclaimed such vlowfl , it is evident that his ardent loyalty bad not risen to a very high pitch in the thermometer of loyal tj ; for I think he avowed that his lojalty is of suet , a description , tbat provid , d ho can get democratic inelltuli . MiB , it is mattgr of indifference to him whether or not B , e z ; bub be the » overeigo of this country . ( Great laughter . ) This , sir , I do most cordially wish , that when tbe ben . and learned gen-leman has got the sovereign or his choice , he vull hive confidence In the Crown . ( Roan of laughtvr . ) Thon-h the honourable and learned gentleman aaya that these xclted
be can maintain his influenoo ov « r s thousands and tens of thousands , whom he brings to . gether by professions of loyalty to ids sovereign , which , not voluntarily , but after the quotation ot bis own words , he is led to avow ; it appenrs that bis loyally . csBrtais in indifference ns to whether the Pops , the Pretender , or tho Devil bo the sovereign . ( Laughter aad cheers . ) From tbia point the hon . bartmot passed ou to Franco and the ' social doctrines' now nOveoateQ In ' that country at the present time . . I make no reference to the pollttoal events that are passing in another country . My firm belief Is . that the security ef every existing government aepenrs upon rigid abstinence from any interference with what is passing in France . ( Cheers . ) We may maintain our own opialens oh tbat subject . I have mine But I boliev ' e it to bs essential to tho poaee of tha world ond to the stability of government that the
experiments now making in France shall have a fwr trial withoot being embarrassed or disturbed by exirineic intervention . ( Loud cheers . ) But at tho same time with respect to * ociol principles , I must say thU , that ' l hopo the working classes of this country will not be deluded by the doctrines that are hold upon tbot aa Vject whteh intimately concerns thotr labour and tho wogos of labour ; ( Loud chocrs . ) If the doctrines that are thi-re maintained be trae , if ttwiwbe indeed aa antagonism between capital and laboos— if it be true that all m » n , without nf . Tonoo to their daffertnt OBptbi . litios different strength , oud different oftpicltles , ore to have some iron formula applied to them , nnd all to receive the same daily wages—if thesa tbiugs be trua , than all tho eipcrionco ami all the lights of the last 150 years haire existed in vain . ( Chfccis . ) Lstuwbxiru the works of Tvugot , Say , nnd A 4 aia Smith . Lsi us
rstabllsh in triumph the doctritua of the Mississippi scheme , and the doctrines of tbat Lavp who W 33 supposed to iCTelve Franca in misery and cosfusion . ( Louil chews . ) Ln us wait for-tho results tf ibis experiment , let us calmly contemplate whe ' thtr it i nanfilb ' e . ihat executive govcrnuaeata eaaba gseatvasu . ' ft » oturer 8—whether U is possible for- them t iorco capital to employ inOuBiry—whether » iUtj can contraTOce the decrees of Providence , ant j reduca all man , without ve ' iifenoo < o hab ! Ol streng th to receive * he Bama wngeB .- ( OijetP 8 1 Pur God ' s saltD gh > & that social princi ' pia ^ same fair trial &B you are about to see given to Mie politioaH >« ndple . ( Cheore . ) But I do mrnrftl y trust—I have tbat confluence in the £ ond aense of t £ e woil ^ na . classes ef » Wo souatrj—that they will Wan that na
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falne delusion of the compulsory sharing of profits , no ramity directed igainet capital , no diitiaotlen of competition among individuals , no overpowering of individual enterprise by government undertakings at the public cl < pense , can possibly bo for the benefit of the working clasee » , or havo any other ultimate reanlt than involving them in misery and ruin . ( Loud and continued e&eerlng . Upon the political j > rlnclplosl pronounce no opinion ; but it would be a shamefnl suppression of the troth , without arrogatiDg to ourselTes too much of the liberty of speech , not to predict fatal consequences to thoso social esperlmeats now in progress In other countries . ( Loud cheerB , ) Sir , I have been diverted for a Bhort time from tha imme-_ fnliiA ffaineinn t \ f tho nnfnnnlanrv aft ar \ tier t \ f nfnfita n
diate object * of tiiB bill . ( Choers . ) I believe , as I have stated , that there are political grounds for this temporary iocreaee to tbe authority of the government . I will not attempt to force on the executive government any powers they do not require . All that I have now to deal within the question whether , for two years , he who incites people to intimidate the legislature , not by words , but by dedn . rations of war , shall be subject » o the penalties 0 / felony . I think the circumstances of the time justify the demand . I believe tho people of this country will be encouraged to Ib 8 OOntinu&nee Of those exertions upen whlcfc , and not upon police , aor upon armies , tbe tranquillity , it not the safuty of this country depends . ( Loud and continued cbeeriii ? . )
Mi ? BatoHT said ba hoped tho bouoo would not forget that the right hon . baronet , the member for Tomnortb , had , in the speach just delivered , con 6 ned hinasBlf , when supporting the measure , to approving of it for a limited and tempornry period . But , while tha House rememheted this , he trusted thu ; would also bear In mind thai the responBibls adviser * of the Crown bad original )? intended that this provision of the bill » bouW be permanent and perpotaal . He readily admitted tout tbe bill la lt « paBsage through that housa had been improved ; but he oould by no means admit that that improvement was in nny degree owing to tbe government , ond he , therefore , denied that they were entitled to Bny thanks for the cliatigtti which bad been tfi otea . Tbe right hon . baronet , the member for Tamworth , in the speech which
the househad heard , joined with those who had cobdefflned the pWelice of calling together £ re » t sssero-Wages of the people , as leading to breaches of the peace . Upon that there could be scarcely a second opinion . They all agreed to that j but let the right bon , baronet look back a little to Ma own career , and he wonld see that that species of agitatlen wa ? sometimes altogether unavoidable . Some nineteen or twenty years ago the rifht hon . baronet was opposed to the measure known as Homan Catholic Emancipation ; at tbat critical m ^ mest tho Duke ef Wellington told the world that if concessions were sot made to rbe Reman Catholics bothingcouU averts civil war : hence it mi ^ ht fairly be said that the measure of relief i ) tbe Romaa Catholics of Irtlnnd was one which had been y i' lded solely under tha
influence ot terror . So much for the conceptions then made to the demands of tne Irish people ! What had been tbe case with regard to tbe measuro of Parliamentary Reform t The noble lord at the head of tho government—no one knew it better—could tell the home that ot first the demand for reform was most remarkably moderate , but as time went on the demands of the RsformtM increased in weight and intensity . The Buine history inijtht be told of the measure by which the Corn Laws were repealed . Upon that important question parliament yielded to a powerful nnd well-directed organisation ; famine threatened , and parliament dared not any longer resist . By such means had emancipa . tion , reform , and free-tradebeen carried ; he therefore entreated them to recollect tbat , as members of that
Hous , they wero bound asalduously and earnestly to look into aud etaminothe grievances of which the Irish peo . p ' e co m ^ Uine ^ , with u view to immediate and iffectual redre . s . ' In tout part of the country whera he reeidod the working classed were mere numerous than in any other district of the united kingdom , and he felt himself fully warranted in sayiogihat amongst them communist principles had obtained no very great number of vo . taiies . When the people In any part of the country nere distressed , tbey naturally and eagerly turned their attention to any species of change which offordsd them a prospect of relief ; but it was only to a Very limited ex . tent that tbe doctrines ef communism had been received . Upon such pvmptoma , howerer , thoy ought not impli .
citlytoroiy . It was true tbot ncently , in Manchester , there had been a demonstration io favour of good order : ho woulu say a demonstration as much to be admired and approved as any tbat had elsewhere been displayed ; but truth required that the house ehoa ) d be apprised of this , that tbe people of Lancaahire would not range themselves on the one side or the other if the object were merely fo prevem an expression of opinion . Such were tbe sentiments which he conceived to be prevalent in tbe north of England generally , and ho hoped that the knowledge of their existence would not be lost upon the government . He hoped it would be felt both by Ministers and by parliament that the claimB which many of those persons urged were reasonable ; tbat it would be reasonable to extend tbe franchise from the limited num .
bers who at present enjoyed that privilege to the 5 , 000 , 000 or 6 , 01 ) 0 , 000 who were without it , but who earnestly desired its possession ; it should be extended as fast as the nuiaber of those persons increased who desired to share its action and to partake of tho blessings which it afforded . Mr Montz repeated his oDjectloBS to the bill . Lord J , llu .-siLL briefly adverted to tho different objections urged by the different members against this bill , which , he believed would tend much to the security of the pence of the empire . Ha then referred to tbe etciting aud inflammatory language used in . Dahlia and other parts of Irelaad , observing tbat it might in some parts of tbe country lead to outrage nnd insurrection ; but tbat outrage and insurrection would be put down ,
because the government had the means of so doing at its dUpesal in the loyalty aad affection of the people , and in tbe force ef the army , whose fidelity had been most foully and systematically belied in various ways , both in and out of parUamtnt . He then proceeded to state that immediately afterBaster the house would proceed to the discussion of measures which related to thepoliti cal state of the Irish population . With ref . renca to the Repeal of the Union , bis lordship thus delivered himself . I must beg to allude for a moment to s debate , which was necessarily interrupted , and to alleged grievances , which are isow stated as a ground for aikiDg the people of Ireland to resort to arms . We were asked the other , day to consent to the repeal of tke existing union between Eugland and Ireland . Njw , un looking evtr the
nets and discussions of the parliament in Ireland—that parliament which has bun referred toao one which gave happiness and contentment te the country , nnd which , if it had continued , woald have secured the prosperity and liberties of the peopk—I find that some of the most distinguished mea in IrcluEd , having at their head Mr Grattan—a namo nevor to be mentionad without honour repeatedly btating in that parliament of Ireland , tb&t the whole government was carried on by corruptionthf . talmo 8 tthem' -jority , ifnotelUteoi 8 JjrUyofehatpar . liorrunt , received pansion * during pleasure and salaries iromtuoorowu—that peerages were sold , and tboc the whole government was a mass of selfishness and «> f bought 8 uff .-sge 5 in support ot the government . I find that Mr G rut tan likowiaa declared that tha suffrages of
Ireland in respect to the elociion of members were sold ; that in some boroug l ; i thuro were only tenjoters , in another only twelva , ond that tbe reform of Parliament was abioiutely necessary . I find Mr Orattan , in r > f « rriug to the details of tee mode of eolheting titheB in IreUnd , observed . —an d his observation was enforced by great tj ' oqu- nee and amazing vigour of language , —that every farmer and peasant in tbe country was subjected to the dreadful grievance of a ' subordination ot lulturee , ' He likewise urged that the great proportion of the people of Ireland , namely , those protesslDg the Ro . jan Catholio faith , wero debarred from privileges which the ProttBtant subjects of that kingdom enjoyed . Let us consider what those grievances were , as stated by one of the most eloquent and able of tbe patriots of Ireland ,
and what tbs parihment of tbe Unifed Kingdom ha ; since done . With raspect to peerages and penUeas , no sue !) abuse bow exists as was their stated . No one will say that anything similar to that which Ur Graitau stated , whether juttly or not , tr > be an existing g * ie-T 3 HCO la his time , is now to be witnessed . As to tithes , tbe question has been settled in such a manner that it is no longtr a grievance to ths peasant 0 ? tho former .. With respect to reform of Parliament , that question hns HkewiBB boon oarried in the united Parliament . With reject to Romas Catholic relief , and the adniltskm ot Homon Citbollcs to the privileges ol tha conBtitaUioo , that question has likewise feeem carried in tne > united Parliament , Why , then , ws bare at least Miis presumption in faronr of the united Parliament , — tnafi those
which were stated to bo tho greatest grievances- while tho Irish Parliament lasted have Blnce baeri retjnesaed by a Parliament of the United Kingdom . ( Chassa . J If this , then , ba the case , — if t&ese grievances bavobeen redressed by the Parliareent of the united hl&gdom , —if , ns I believe , the Parllum ' jiit of the united kingdom is able to legislate for Ireland more adrantagsoualy for tho people- of Ireland , w . f > vitU lees chaaoe oi hostile collision , with this countty , or of discard amoag the various c 1 bbb « 8 , than the ' Parliament of Ireland could do , then I should say , apart from all imperial interests , that we are bound to r withstand all those measures , in whatever form they ' . Bay appear , which have the repeal of th « legislative 1 inion for their object . Let auy hon ,
membe ? brin g ftr < / ora 8 BCD proportions as may tcnti , In nis opinion , to , the advantage of Ireland ; and to any prepo . sition whic > t may be supported by the great majority of the Irish merocere , haying for Us objsot to improve tbe Una of t » ^ coun try , the situation of laudlord and tenant , or to re- , n Ove any 80 ciai or peUtteal grievance- undtr which tney thinl . they iabourj T shal , bfi fcady tQ "sttn . . but by djscueeion , if , h 0 cn 0 | ce ^^ or lor r . rgument aud Utbate in Parliament , or if , on the cov . trary , tho moans ehonsn should be txeiting the people 0 arms , and to metmrvB of force — then by force , if * eceasaty , I will , ss long as tucra is any breath or life m me , oppose the repeal of taa legislative union , ( Loud chviers . )
Tho house then divided , when , thty were—3 ? -r the third reading 205 Against it ,,. ,. , 40 Majority , „ , 255 The bill ttis then read a Ci'rd time . Ou the question that the bill do pass , Mr Hchk BaVd ho approved of most of the provisions of this bin , but ba strongly objected to ( he clause which , imuosed severe penalties on' opea and advhedf peaking ;' and , lu order to place eti rieord his protest ag&luet that portion 0 $ tbe mtasure , he woaU move thattoose tvoicIb
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.. ^ . n ^ ,,. , -nr _ -- ^ - ¦ ZT' J ^ g be omitted . H « wnsidtrtCl that if (/^ njw ^ ^ tvisfitd to prevent the meetivgt af tit Natknai ^^ 1 SJ ttiey had ample power to rfo 30 unfa the 5 Vh 0 ** % " C and , as thty possetstd that power , ht timtght YS It lif Aaue exercised . ie . Hu agreed that most i ' dm , '" l / i guage bed been used in Ireland ; but ho » o to C the government to let tbosG who h ad medsn u , 8 d » j , waste their breath - ( dries of Ob , oh ! ' )_ Ho , ? tent themselves with adopting aaoh proceedm to ° ^ I those psnoHB ss were authorised by the bx i fi % \ He would not tako the se&sfl if the house oa u * K as itB opinion bad just been eapressed b y so k Bl > li ll i ' jority , but he withed te put on Record his prot . » a "ul this clause . ^ "» 8 « l , Mr H Bsbkekt bfggea fer himself , » nfl on } , his constituents , who—with the exception of # * "tl sobs calling themselves Chartists—were nna . * Per . their opinions , to thank the noble lord at th ""? "! ' the government for bringing forward soeoergetln ° f sura for preserving the peace and tranauii , u &rilEl >« country . . ^"'" Jo fti , The amendment proposed by Mr Home the tived withoat a division , and the motion , »„„ lf ^ do p « B » , ' w « fl agreed to amid cheers from both . ia " the house ; DOtn «< ies The sitting of the boose woa then , at a rjuart four o ' clock , suspended until half . pa . jt flTa er PMt At the adjourned sitting , _ , _ _ i ^ fafi OIXHttflQ . Sk ttonsl / lsrs / f thsri if *\ . ~ ^^"* ™^^ v
Mr A . Stafford moved that a new writ bo orders , issue for Horaham , in tke room of Mr Jjij ' a ' Atter a discussion the motion was withdrawn and «• J . HAHME& obtained leave to bring in a bill to an commissioners to inquire iato the exfs'enoe of corm practices at elections for certain boroughs . pt Mr Boovbbie obtained leave to origin ' a ' bill t 0 able religious congregations to obtain eites for cimt 2 * In Scotland . "' Mr Rbtnolds obtained leave to bring in a bill t 9 * w . linh the . proeets of attachment of goods in Courts of U , " oorda of tho municipal tforporatl-ns ot Ireland , On tbe motifln of Mr Beinolds , the Municipal Corpo . rations ( Ireland ) Bill wus rtad a second time , Sir q . Grey stipulating that the bill sbonld not 50 Into commit tee until the government measure on tho sama aubjeei skonld ba before the home . The house adjourned at a quarter past eight o ' eloct , WEDNESDAY , Apbii , 19 .
HOUSE OF LORDS . — The Oagoiko BitL , —1 hf Lobd CuANCBiioR moved the s cond roadiDj ? of the bil for the better necur ty of the Crown and Govtrnmen of the TJi , ittd Kingdom . Tho nofele and learned lori shortly glanced at the acts of those who profesied to bi fritnds of the people and of liberty , but who were tbe enemies of both , and whose conduct mado the passint of some suoh law sa that now proposed absolutel y no . cessary . The danger and disturbance of the public peacf arose , in this country nnd Ireland , mainly from open snd deliberate inailetnaats to treason and sedition and therefore , to put an end to such practices was a main portion of the bill .
Lord Sianiet supported the bill , as did Lord jodghah , who fcrgged to sirs' a solatsry warning tc the newspapers ; there was no doubt that Parliament had certais privileges &y which thi-y could protect them , selves within doors for whatever they might utter , but let do newspaper reporter or editor bore the notion thai whatever might be enid in Parliament he had a right tc report and print , for if it was treason he was as liable to be punishsd for it as if he had himself invented it : and this might also baa warning to those who were daily printing and circulating treason and sedition ut tered in different parts of the country . If they prohibited sedition and treason from b « n < utter « d in tbe . National Convention and similar places , what signified it whilst it the Other House of P . rllnment snch language might b < ottPTf d and afterwards printed , and sent forth to tbe wn . I ?
lord CiMTMBiL Mimitled that the bill wotrfd noi reach Hr Smith O'Brien iu the treasonabia speech h < made in the House of Coramona the other night , or thi reporters , editors and ptopri » tors of newspapsrs : and he should have boon aehamei of the bill If it bad has such an tffect , If any member within tbe walls ef Par . liament spoke sedition or treason , he must be answer able for such ofivnee thero . One of tbe mjstoatrageoa ; attempts made by Charles the First , asd that which was probably tbo main cause of bringing him ta the blocl-, vt as the prosecution of re embers of parliament in court ! of law for speeches mado in their places ia parliament , Se didnot believe tkat the publication of the spercbei which had bet-n alluded to had given any encourajjtmeE ( to the crimes -which they sought to Instigate ; on tnj OOUtrary , he thought th « y hail bad » elreng tendency t «
rouse the spirit of order in tho minds of Englishmen , ( Hear , hear . ) He would be the last to wish to punish any one for giving faithful reports of the proceedings in parliament , for he hai introduced a clause into his bill on tnelawof libeJ , making ouly the printer and pub . Usher of tha newspnper liable ; and his noble and learned friend opposite ( LoH Brougham ) hid supported tbat bill . ( Laughter . ) Tbe person who gave a lonafldt and honeat reportof what took place was surely exempt from imputation , and ought not to be liable to punish ment . ( Hear , hear . ) He hoped the bill would be effi caclous for the purpose for which it was intended , namely , to restrain seditious and treasonable speeches made in the National Convention , as it was . termed , Conciliation Hall , and similar places . ( Hear , hear . ) Ha disapproved of Lord Eldon ' s bill in 1796 . and no still di ?<
approrad of it ' , but it did not follow irnm that hs should disapprove of the present measure , the object of which was to reduce to the crime of felony a crime which had heretofore been considered high treason , and to extend it to Ireland . There was . 1 elause in the oil ) , by which whatever was declared treason under the statute of the 25 th of Edw . III ., was still preserved as treason , He denied that any new offencewas created by the bill . Tha noble and learned lord epposite ( Lord Brougham ) criticised the language of the third section of the bill , but it was totidem verbis tbe language © f the S 6 6 eo . III ., which was itself taken from the statute of Charles II . He would be the last person to consent to a measure of this kind , if he thought itwonfd in the least interfere with fair and ' egitimate discuss on . With respect to-the con . viction of Muir and Palmer , he thought it was not
according to law , but was entirely contrary to law . T&eir sedition consisted in making temperate speeches ia favour of the Reform Bill ; and his noble and learned friends had made , he would not say more violent but certainly more animated speeches than those for which Sluir and Pi . Imer were sent to Botany day . Under this-bill open , nnd advised speaking would not constitute an offence . To constitute an offence under this bill it should'ba ' open and advised speaking , ' with the view of compassing the deposition of the Queen , or levying war against the Queen , or compassing- or planning the invasion of the Queen ' s dominions by a foreign force . Ana he wonld ask , was it not right to prove these offences by open-and adrisedsp : ailing . The Duke of WeMiIngtov said he fully approved of the bi'l . ( Hear , hear . ) He concurred in the opinion that some measure was recssary for tbe purpose of making
the aet quite sufficient in order to oppose some check to those groat and gigantic meetings by which ; tflis country and the [ si 3 ter kingdom hare been disturbed for some years past Tbeywere at last come to that stage-that the lawwas despised and condemned by every one- of thoE * persons who-broke it . This contempt of the- law was ruining this country day by any , aad destroying that respect for it which had been its * characteristic for a ^ es ; The country was coming to that state that it would be of no authority , and then thero-mmld be no means of enforcing the ! aw except b 7 the use of phy ? ical forae .. Ho-warned their 1 irdships airainst sillon-ing their country to come to such- a state of things if they wished to preserve its character and the institutieijH . He hoped that the bill irould pass unanimously , and in the shortest space of- " time , in ordw thnt the government might put it into- operation immediately .
Lord Denmay expressed tho htehegt admiration for the noWe duUe , but thour , Htlu ' -n mistaken when he said thaf there was a growing contempt for the law- * , nothing * so far as his observation -went , could be farther from the real character of the English people . The Earl of St Gef ^ uns said , as to ' open and advised speafcing . 'he thought the mischief of-the speaking wae extremely small , compared with that done by . the-public 3-tion . TneNationnfcSonvention and tile-Irish Confederation were but Bmall'b ' odics ; but thelss- proceedings wen rend by great numbers . It was truc-thet-ditors el newspapers exercised n sounS discretion in suppressing pas j sages unfit for publication ; aud hs thought if- that dis , cretion were continued , it would be successful ia prerent ling any badetTectSk In cases whene such discretion wai not exercised , lefexiie parties be prosecuted ;
Lord Camfbeia said , if seditious and trea ^ onaible senti merits were published for the purpose of- girflig e ^ cct ti them , that waina h- ' ghly culpable misdemaauor , or i might be prosecuted under the present bill as an over net for compassing the deposition of tho- ( sjueen . Ai editor of a newspaper publishing a-. trensonublo spseeh witi such an intent ,, might thus be psowcuted and transporte beyond tbo asan . ' ... . ,. « The Lord Chancellor trusted- the efftofr of _ this ; bi ) would be to atop tho speaking * and then , of course , th publication tvould be stopped * Tho bill this then read a seoond Urns . The Election Recognizances Bill was tt&en read a thir Bins . ' . :-, Their lossdships then ailjswned at ele'bt o'clock . !?
HOUSK OF COMMONS ^—COBBSB Pt / BWC BUSINE ! / fteb Vaster —Lord J . 3 u ? ssell , in r&ply to a questio from Mv-Ewart , stated thai the govevament had receive information , which ho was not at liberty to disclos which nendered tho introduction of a Bill for the removi of aKe » BBeeessary ; tWfra $ > h , as sneh a Bill was control to the ordinary policy of tliis ceun ** y , it would te onlj temporary measure . The noble lord made a statemjci relative to tho position , of public husiness before paidi ment . and gave nctice cf the order in which he- pr posed to proceed whb the government measure aftostl racesn . On the motion that tho house , at its riBinc , adjoiaa Saturday . Ms O . UB . m . \ dv 6 Y » attentio * to tne position of ti ^ Saclii vig . IIolstun question . THURSDAY , April 20 . HOUSE OP LOHDS .-CnowK and Government Sec RIT ? BiLL .-On the motion that this bill be vead a thi time .
Lord Brougham Bciilli « h » d no objection totheredv tion of treason to a minor offenee , but lie could not alU that opportunity to pass without stati-g his convicti that the offence of high treason was just as much desi viiig of enpitnl punishment sis the crime of murder . Lord Camtbeia perfectly a ^ reird witfi the opinion of 1 noblo and learned friend , snd could assure the house tV no oii ' enco was fraught with so much dangi-r both to I and }> ri > pevly as that of liigU treason . ( Hear , hear . ) The bill was then read a thivi time and passed . The Public Works Completion ( Ireland ) liill was roae ! third time and passed , after a short discussion . Their WdsWps then adjourned to Saturday , » t t o ' clock .
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Printed Uy BOU&AL M'GOWAN , of 16 , Graat Wlndm ttveet , Haymarket , in the City of Westc&lnster , at ¦ Office , in tho snme Street and Parish , for the l ' rojiris * YE&KGDS O : COXNQK , Esq ., M . l \ , and ymbfel by Wilhak Hewitt , of Vo . IS , Ch ^ rles-stree ^ Hr don-street , Walvforth , ia the parish of St . Maryi K ' ingtoa , In the County of Surrey , nt theOffiee , , Great WtnanwD-stnet , H » jowl < et , in tijo GityofYfi minster . —Saturday April , &na . I 8 i . p .
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. THE NORTHERN STAR . - ¦ AraiL Sfr
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Northern Star (1837-1852), April 22, 1848, page 8, in the Nineteenth-Century Serials Edition (2008; 2018) ncse2.kdl.kcl.ac.uk/periodicals/ns/issues/vm2-ncseproduct1467/page/8/
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